Legislature(1999 - 2000)

04/07/1999 06:07 PM Senate FIN

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
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SENATE BILL NO. 108                                                                                                             
"An Act relating to fees for probation and parole."                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
BEN GRIN, staff to Senator Jerry Ward, would charge                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked if he had a chance to review                                                                      
the fiscal notes.  Ben had not and admitted he was                                                                              
unfamiliar with the bill.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Bruce Richards began by telling the history of the matter.                                                                      
A bill had been adopted and Senator Al Adams had then                                                                           
repealed the legislation.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
The process was very difficult for the department.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
The difference in this bill was that it dictated the                                                                            
department contract out the bill collection process.  They                                                                      
had been unable to find an agency willing to take on the                                                                        
process.  This group of people tended to be difficult to                                                                        
work with.  This year, the department was able to find a                                                                        
bank willing to do this.  He detailed the proposed                                                                              
collection process.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
He noted earlier testimony on the success of a similar                                                                          
program in Texas.  The reason for that success was that the                                                                     
judge set the priority above child support and restitution.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
The fiscal note provided was based on a ten- percent                                                                            
collection rate and would not provide a cash flow. The last                                                                     
time this law was in effect the program only brought in                                                                         
$12,000.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked if the dollar figure was                                                                          
$1.50. Bruce Richards said it was and that was the national                                                                     
average.  Co-Chair John Torgerson noted the sponsor                                                                             
statement was from the prior year.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked how many people this would                                                                        
apply to. Bruce Richards listed the numbers for adults.                                                                         
Department of Health and Social Services would have numbers                                                                     
for youth parolees.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Bruce Richards added that it was unclear in the bill that                                                                       
it was possible to be on probation and parole at the same                                                                       
time.  He suggested an amendment to change that so the                                                                          
person did not have to pay twice since they had the same                                                                        
parole officer.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
He referred to page 3 saying that if the PFD was over the                                                                       
amount due, the Department of Corrections would have to                                                                         
refund the difference.  He suggested changing that so the                                                                       
department did not have the burden of collecting and then                                                                       
returning a balance.  He suggested deleting the language.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked if once the assignment was                                                                        
made by the department, he assumed they could only collect                                                                      
after other attachments were made. Bruce Richards affirmed                                                                      
and said that was the reason the department did not                                                                             
anticipate they would collect much after all the other                                                                          
obligations were satisfied.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams observed that this would be a paperwork                                                                        
nightmare.  It created two groups of people, parolees and                                                                       
those of probation.  Was there any chance an inmate could                                                                       
be both. Bruce Richards said that was his earlier point.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams asked if the department felt this would                                                                        
create a greater burden in collection efforts than it would                                                                     
generate. Bruce Richards said it was and said that was the                                                                      
reason for the fiscal note.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Blair McCune, spoke to the difficulties of collection.  The                                                                     
PDA would not have a fiscal note if the process was set up                                                                      
to not include probation hearings in the determination of                                                                       
collection efforts.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
He noted that many of his clients did not have much assets                                                                      
after they settled their other obligations.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He told the committee which statutes applied to the                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Page 2 line31 he understood it to mean this applied only to                                                                     
situations with close supervision.  He had concerns that                                                                        
the level of supervision was light for those who did well.                                                                      
He felt the fee would have to be commensurate with the cost                                                                     
of the supervision.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
He also had concerns with the parents of children in                                                                            
probation. In some situations the parent or a sibling of                                                                        
the child were the victim.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
He referred to language that said the parole board "shall"                                                                      
revoke parole and felt they should have some discretion.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams asked if the agency would handle both                                                                          
parolees and those on probation who were charged with not                                                                       
paying.  Would that increase the workload?  Blair said they                                                                     
represented before the parole board those faced with                                                                            
returning to jail. They would be impacted because they had                                                                      
the burden of showing how the non-payment was justified.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
ROBERT BUTCANE, Juvenile Probation Officer, Department of                                                                       
Health and Social Services, testified in opposition to the                                                                      
bill. He suggested deleting sections from the bill in order                                                                     
to exempt juvenile offenders from the provisions.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
The department would have to have to create a collection                                                                        
unit that would not serve the mission of the department.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Department of Health and Social Services placed a high                                                                          
obligation on the parent to participate in the process.                                                                         
That included financial obligations.  Sometimes the other                                                                       
costs of these youths placed a burden on the family's                                                                           
finances.  He also spoke of instances where the victim is                                                                       
also a member of the family.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator Al Adams noted most of the PFD collected went to                                                                        
the victims.  He asked that percentage.  Robert Butcane was                                                                     
unsure but said most restitution in was beyond the amount                                                                       
of the PFD so most went to the victim.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked about the victim service                                                                          
grants listed on the fiscal note.  Robert Butcane answered                                                                      
that when the accounts showed receipts in excess of                                                                             
expenditures, the balance was intended to go to support                                                                         
victim services. This would be done by means of grants to                                                                       
community organizations to benefit those who experienced                                                                        
the impact of juvenile crime. This presumed the provided                                                                        
figures were accurate                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson asked for clarification that the                                                                        
bill did not stipulate a specific grant program. Robert                                                                         
Butcane affirmed.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair John Torgerson ordered the bill held in committee.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                

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